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Titanic post! I couldn't coincide more with your points. It's happy to give some thought to such mindful insights shared here.
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Hidden In Him

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You alive Chris ?
 

MoreBloodWine

October 14, 2020, 06:17:44 PM
But ya, any PM's sent they should be made aware of via email, if they have notifications set for receipt of a PM.

But even if so, my newsletter blast can ignore such settings so anyone registered will at least get my message. But I can name them specifically in it for *** & giggles.
 

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Still need to check some things but that will be easy enough to do via PM.

When the site is re-opened. It is now, but tech locked down... but when it's "back". I can send out a newsletter, anyone who has an email attached that they still use will be made aware / be able to come back if that's what they choose to do.
 

Hidden In Him

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You're kidding... That would be something. Any way to contact ShadowKen and Indybones? And maybe Pineapple, LoL. I suppose if it's all intact I could just message and it would go thru to email.
 

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October 14, 2020, 01:53:33 AM
@HIM: The MP is back, but it will need to remain in maintenance mode until I can re skin it / fix some of the underlying addons, But it is loading again... all data should still be intact.

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Hidden In Him

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Hidden In Him

April 08, 2020, 10:37:46 AM
This one's pretty good, LoL. Should be fun to put on video some day.  :)
http://www.spiritualwarbiblestudies.com/index.php?topic=181.msg207#msg207
 

Hidden In Him

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 :) :) :)
 

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Everything happens for a reason, even if it's rewriting old works ;-)
 

Hidden In Him

March 07, 2020, 07:12:18 PM
My wife dislikes the idea that I'm rewriting studies rather than writing new ones, but the Lord is now opening up Colossians to me like never before, and some work needs to be redone. Very excited about the new insight!  :)
 

Hidden In Him

February 29, 2020, 02:19:44 PM
...get back to making sure studies were ready to put on camera when the time comes.  :)

So how's life with you?  
 

Hidden In Him

February 29, 2020, 02:18:44 PM
I noticed you were still lurking around, LoL. Glad to see I'm not the only one happy about it.  :) Hard at work converting the garage into a recording studio & music room. Gonna be nice! The soundproofing is going to be work and money, but a lot of it is already purchased. In the meantime, I had to
 

MoreBloodWine

February 29, 2020, 01:59:43 AM
 :) :) :)
 

Hidden In Him

February 28, 2020, 05:43:50 PM
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Blessings in Christ to all who visit,
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November 02, 2019, 02:37:56 AM
I rarely ever used Tapatalk to log in to the site. Not sure if anyone ever actually did as the issue of it not working was never reported.

But for our mobile uses, certain things like this chat box will not be available through the app as this chat box is an addon itself. But all boards within the forum are available and currently confirmed working.

Ty & my apologies !
 

Hidden In Him

August 05, 2019, 03:21:06 PM
An excellent passage I am now writing a study on in the Book of Colossians.

"And I am now rejoicing in [my] sufferings over you, and filling up in my flesh what is lacking of the afflictions of Christ for His body's sake, which is the church, of which I became a servant
 

Hidden In Him

August 05, 2019, 03:20:49 PM
... of which I became a servant according to the administration of God having been given unto me, for you to fulfill the word of God, the mystery which has been hidden from ages and from generations but which has now been made manifest to His saints, to whom God wished to make known what

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Author Topic: Jude 1:14-16  (Read 2624 times)

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Hidden In Him

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Jude 1:14-16
« on: February 05, 2016, 01:42:25 PM »
Does The Christian God Delight In Human Sufferings?

      Satan is not merely an accuser of the brethren. One of Jude's main points in this entire letter was that through the Gnostics, Satan was becoming an accuser of the Most High God Himself, a point he was now making clear by identifying them as the ones Enoch had prophesied about:

     But Enoch, the seventh-generation descendant from Adam, also prophesied to these men, saying, "Behold, the Lord came with ten thousands of his holy angels to execute judgment against all, and to reprove all the ungodly concerning all their ungodly works which they committed in ungodliness, and concerning all the harsh words ungodly sinners spoke against Him." These are murmurers, complainers, walking in accordance with their lusts… (Jude 1:14-16a)

     What did Jude mean by describing them as "murmurers"? This was an allusion to the Israelites murmuring against God in the wilderness. They saw giants living in the promised land, and since most did not have the faith to believe God would defeat these giants on their behalf, they began accusing the Lord of leading them to their deaths. By insinuation, it appears Jude was saying the followers of Simon's heresy were likewise accusing God, i.e. the Old Testament God of leading His servants to their deaths at the hands of persecutors.
     But the apostles understood very well why God was allowing them to suffer for their faith, and they very clearly explained it in their teachings. But unfortunately the Gnostics completely ignored such teachings, because they were determined to accuse God of being cruel, sadistic, and delighting in human suffering.   


"Why Has God Sent Us Here To Die?"

     When the twelve spies returned from surveying the promised land, ten of the twelve gave an evil report to the children of Israel, telling them they should not go up and try to take the land, for "We saw giants there, and we were like locusts before them, and so were we in their eyes." (Numbers 13:34). As a result, great fear swept through the congregation that night, and they determined together to return to Egypt:

     And all the congregation lifted up their voice and cried, and the people wept during the night. And all the children of Israel murmured against Moses and against Aaron. And all congregation said to them, "Oh that we had died in the land of Egypt, or in this wilderness. Oh that we had died! And why is Jehovah bringing us into this land to fall by the sword? Our wives and our infants will be a prey. Is it not good for us to return to Egypt?" And they said each to his brother, "Let us appoint a leader, and return to Egypt."
     Then... Joshua son of Nun and Caleb son of Jephunneh, of those who spied out the land, tore their garments. And they spoke to all the congregation of the children of Israel, saying… "Do not rebel against Jehovah. And do not fear the people of the land, for they are our bread. Their defense has departed from them, and Jehovah is with us. Do not be afraid of them."
     But all the congregation said to stone them with stones. Then the glory of the Lord appeared to all the children of Israel in the tent of meeting. And Jehovah said to Moses, "How long will this people despise Me? And how long will they continue not to believe in me, for all the miraculous signs which I have done in their midst?" (Numbers 14:1-11, Masoretic)


     The Lord Himself identified here two reasons why they were murmuring against Him: 1. They secretly despised Him, and 2. They were faithless, and would sooner believe He was leading them to their deaths than trust He was bringing them into a land flowing with milk and honey, despite witnessing Him perform many miraculous signs on their behalf.
     The followers of Simon's heresy shared similar characteristics. As Irenaeus recorded concerning one Gnostic leader named Marcion:

     Marcion of Pontus... advanced a most daring blasphemy against Him who is proclaimed as God by the law and the prophets, declaring Him to be the author of evils, to take delight in war, to be lame of purpose, and to even be contrary to Himself. (Irenaeus, Against Heresies, XXVII, 2)

     In other words, the accusation here was the the God of the Jews delighted in human suffering. While modern Gnostics make these same assertions today, the best examples of this argument can be found in articles written by their spiritual brethren, the Satanists. Gnostic teachings are essentially the same as Satanist teachings in this regard. They share a common disdain for the belief that the Christian God is a kind and benevolent being.
     The following are excerpts from a Satanist article that expresses the typical Satanist contention that if there is a God, He must be evil:

     If God was all-powerful and all-loving... there would be no human-created evil, and no need for evil, suffering or death in the world in any way. However, there is evil and death in very great quantities, therefore it holds that, if the situation was created by a god, then such a god is not omnipotent and benevolent. Given that such a god exists, it must be malevolent: An evil god, who created life for the sole purpose of watching life suffer.
     Such a god would make life, in its very essence, impossible to exist without death, violence, suffering and struggle. Advanced life, especially, would be inherently prone to nastiness, wars, immorality, killing and causing of suffering. As since this is how it is in the world, it holds that the existence of such levels of suffering, if it is the result of intelligent design, is thoroughly evil, and to call god "good" is a corruption of the truth.
     As it happens, the world is as we would expect it to be if the designer of life was evil. Ancient religious minds also realized this. Gnostic religions such as the Manicheans explained that this world was the creation of an evil God, and that we had to somehow escape from it. (God Must Be Evil [If It Exists], DPJS.co.uk)

     The above writer also quotes Bertrand Russell to further support his argument:
 
     Some people criticize this, asking, if the world was designed by an evil God, why is there some happiness and goodness in the world? Why isn't the world purely evil, with only suffering? [But] “A Manichean might retort that this is the worst of all possible worlds, in which the good things that exist serve only to heighten the evils. The world, he might say, was created by a wicked demiurge [who] created some virtuous men, in order that they might be punished by the wicked; for the punishment of the virtuous is so great an evil that it makes the world worse than if no good men existed.” (History of Western Philosophy, by Bertrand Russell, 1946)

    Quoting from Mark Twain, he then goes on to add that a truly good god would let everyone go to Heaven:

     If God is forgiving or loving (or exists...) then it would automatically and instantaneously place everyone in Heaven. Why doesn't God do this? Because god is neither all-loving nor forgiving! Life is a game intended to draw out peoples' lives as much as possible, making them endure the maximum amount of pain that is logically possible... because God, if there is one, is utterly evil… "[God could have made] good children as easily as bad, yet preferred to make bad ones; [He] could have made every one of them happy, yet never made a single happy one; [He] made them prize their bitter life, yet stingily cut it short; [He] gave his angels eternal happiness unearned, yet required his other children to earn it; [He] gave his angels painless lives, yet cursed his other children with biting miseries and maladies of mind and body…" [Mark Twain's Diatribe] (God Must Be Evil [If It Exists], DPJS.co.uk)

     Taken together then, the Gnostic/Satanist accusation against God is two-fold: Firstly, He delights in watching people suffer. Then, once He has seen them suffer long enough, He delights in watching them die. Both accusations shall be addressed in this study, starting with the claim that God delights in watching men die. As shall be seen, in God's foreknowledge, the angels were not allowed to suffer martyrdom as the saints do because none of them would be given the opportunity to reign with Christ for eternity.


The Wisdom Of God Concerning Kingship

     According to the apostle Paul, the saints possessed a wisdom unbelievers did not, a wisdom based upon knowing why God allowed Jesus to be crucified. In short, along with paying the price for man's redemption, God's intent was to establish Christ's trustworthiness as a Ruler throughout all eternity. By allowing Him to die a substitutionary death on behalf of every person who would enter His kingdom, this set up a situation where the Lord Jesus would be forever revered as a self-sacrificial Ruler unquestionably worthy of all love, honor and respect.
     Unfortunately this message was viewed as foolishness by the faithless, especially by the Greek philosophers, because it asked them to believe that the very Son of God would allow Himself crucified by the Romans. Their brand of earthly, humanistic wisdom did not allow for such a seemingly preposterous claim. Yet as the apostle Paul would tell the Corinthians, human wisdom was now being repudiated by the Lord, as was His plan from the very beginning:     

     The message of the cross is foolishness unto those who are perishing, but to we who are being saved it is the power of God. For it has been written, "I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and repudiate the intelligence of the intelligent"... And whereas the Jews ask for signs and the Greeks seek wisdom, we proclaim Christ having been crucified, truly a scandal for the Jews and foolishness to the Gentiles. But for those who are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ is the power of God and the wisdom of God, for the "fool" of God is wiser than men, and the "weakling" of God is stronger than men. (1 Corinthians 1:18-25)

     To prove Christ was the Messiah, the Jews were requesting signs from Heaven (see Matthew 16:1) that would signal that the appearance of the Messiah was imminent, and that God's power was behind Him, such as those described in the Book of Joel:

     I will show wonders in the heavens and on the earth, blood and fire and billows of smoke. The sun will be turned to darkness and the moon to blood before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the Lord. And everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved; for on Mt. Zion and in Jerusalem there will be deliverance, as the Lord has said, even amongst the survivors whom the Lord calls. (Joel 2:30-32)

     To the Gentile philosophers, however, no divine power or intervention was needed to establish an empire on earth. Rome had already built an empire. What was needed was the wisdom to maintain it. Absolute power corrupted absolutely, and if a morally weak man rose to power it wouldn't be long before the entire empire began began crumbling, as it plunged into tyranny, corruption and moral decline. Assassination attempts usually followed, but these more often than not served to undermine the empire even further.
     This is why Greek philosophers like Plato argued that a ruler needed to possess surpassing moral character. He needed to be "a master of academia, having the education of the known sciences, mathematics, astronomy and astrology, and a five year study of the philosophy of dialectics, and a further 15 years of study in self-control, manners, resistance and resilience..." Most importantly, however, he needed to be "of supreme and superior character," being seen by his citizens as "incorruptible, due to his high moral values, and his love for justice and truth." (Philosopher Kings: Reign Justification and Characteristics, Nicholas Mtetesha)

                                                               

     Plato even argued that a truly wise philosopher-king should demonstrate his selfless dedication to the empire by foregoing all rights to owning private property or having a family, a view considered too extreme by later philosophers: 

     "In Plato's hands, however, this template [for wise rulership] included some specific political prescriptions... which most of his successors abhorred. In particular, Book V of the Republic suggests that a sufficiently unified regime can be achieved only by depriving its guardian-rulers of private property, and of private families, instead making them live in austere communal conditions in which they are financially supported by their money-making subjects, and allowed to procreate only when and with whom will best serve the city." (Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy, Ancient Political Philosophy)

     In other words, through the lifestyle they led, wise rulers were to demonstrate that they were entirely self-sacrificing, so as to maintain the people's trust.
     In this regard, however, the supposed "fool" of God whom Paul was preaching, the risen Son of God, was proving Himself wiser than men. Christ's "obedience unto death" in allowing Himself to be crucified for the same of man's sins demonstrated self-sacrifice on a level the rulers and Greek philosophers had never dreamt of. As he stated, had the rulers known, they would not have nailed the "King of the Jews" to the cross:

     But we speak wisdom among the mature, only not the wisdom of this age nor of the rulers of this age, who are being deposed. But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery which has been hidden, which God preordained for our glory before time, which none of the rulers of this age had known, for if they had known it they would not have crucified the Lord of glory. (1 Corinthians 2:6-8) 


Walking Worthy Of Kingship Together With Christ

     Yet, in God's plan, Christ would not be reigning alone over the coming kingdom of God. The Spirit had prophesied numerous times that the saints would be inheriting the kingdoms of this world with Him:

     I beheld, and that horn (i.e. the Antichrist) made war with the saints, and prevailed against them until the Ancient of Days came, and He gave judgment to the saints of the Most High. And the time arrived, and the saints possessed the kingdom… [and thus] the kingdom and the power and the greatness of the kings that are under the whole heaven were given over to the saints of the Most High; and His kingdom is an everlasting kingdom, and all His rulers shall serve and obey Him. (Daniel 7:21-22, 27 LXX)

     The disciples very well knew they would be among these rulers when the time came. They well remembered the teachings of the Lord Jesus Christ Himself in this regard:

     Jesus said to them, "Truly I say to you that in the resurrection, when the Son of Man shall sit on the throne of His glory, you which have followed Me shall also sit on twelve thrones judging the twelve tribes of Israel." (Matthew 19:28)

     "And I appoint unto you a kingdom, as my Father hath appointed unto me, that ye may eat and drink at My table in My kingdom, and sit on thrones judging the twelve tribes of Israel." (Luke 22:29-30)

     And he said unto him, "Well, thou good servant: because thou hast been faithful in a very little, have thou authority over ten cities." And the second came, saying, "Lord, thy pound hath gained five pounds." And he said likewise to him, "Be thou also over five cities." (Luke 19:17-19)

     Yet He also informed them that such honors would come only to those who imitated His self-sacrifice by enduring affliction, even unto death if necessary, in proclaiming the truth of the gospel of the coming kingdom:

     Then the mother of Zebedee's children came to Him with her sons, worshipping Him, and asking something from Him. And He said to her, "What do you desire?" She said to Him, "Say that these two sons of mine may sit, one on Your right hand and one on Your left in Your kingdom." But having answered, Jesus said [to James and John], "You do not know what you ask for. Are you able to drink the cup which I am about to drink, and be baptized with the baptism I am being baptized in?" They said to Him, "We are able." And He said to them, "Indeed you shall drink My cup and be baptized with the baptism I am being baptized in, but to sit on My right hand and on My left is not Mine to give, but [will be given] by My Father only to the one whom it has been prepared for." (Matthew 20:20-23)

     The cup He was about to drink was martyrdom, and the baptism He was about to be baptized in was bodily affliction and death. Thus, they would soon enough understand that if they were to reign over the twelve tribes of Israel as promised to them, they would have to imitate Him in likewise drinking of this cup. As history records, all of the twelve disciples eventually did. (Note: Some traditions state John merely died of old age, but he too was martyred).
     And it was not just the apostles who had the opportunity to inherit kingship in eternity. Jesus Himself made similar offers to all believers, such as when he told the entire congregation in Laodicea the following:

     I counsel you to buy from Me gold having been purified by fire, and white garments that you may clothe yourself with and the shame of your nakedness not be made manifest, and eye salve to anoint your eyes with so that you may see… To the one who overcomes, I will grant to him to sit with Me on My throne, just as I also overcame and sat down with My Father on His throne. (Revelation 3:18, 21)

     "Gold purified by fire" referred to a faith purified by the fires of suffering and persecution (1 Peter 1:6-7). And because they were still spiritually poor, so to speak (see Revelation 3:17), Jesus was counseling them to "buy" true riches from Him, i.e. pray for the honor of being allowed to suffer for the kingdom's sake. That it was indeed an honor to do so was the same mindset the apostles walked in, for they understood the wisdom of God:

     And having called the apostles in and beaten them, they commanded them not to speak in the name of Jesus, and released them. Therefore, they departed from the presence of the Sanhedrin rejoicing, for they were accounted worthy to be dishonored for His name's sake. (Acts 5:40-41)

     This, then, is why God allowed the saints to die for their faith. Far from being a tragedy, in the eyes of the wise it was more an opportunity to walk worthy of greater authority in the coming kingdom of God.


Silencing The Accuser Of The Brethren

     Satan is describe as "the accuser of the brethren," and it must be understood that another reason God allows the righteous to die for their faith is precisely to prove his accusations false. Until he is finally cast out of Second Heaven and can no longer approach the throne of God, scripture says Satan will continue to accuse the brethren before God might and day. But in the end-times, it is prophesied that many will overcome his accusations by not loving their lives unto death:

     And I heard a loud voice in Heaven, declaring, "Now has come the salvation and power and kingdom of our God, and the authority of His Messiah, because the accuser of our brethren was cast down, the one accusing them before our God day and night. And they overcame him through the blood of the Lamb, and through the word of their testimony, and did not love their life unto death. (Revelation 12:10-11)

     Why will God allow end-time believers to suffer? The above passage suggests it will be to prove they are not guilty of the very things Satan is accusing them of. The same was true of Job. Scripture suggests God knowingly permitted the Devil to bring destruction upon his life precisely to prove that Satan's accusations against him were false:

     Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan also came among them. The Lord said to Satan, “From where do you come?” Then Satan answered the Lord and said, “From roaming about on the earth and walking around on it.” The Lord said to Satan, “Have you considered My servant Job? For there is no one like him on the earth, a blameless and upright man, fearing God and turning away from evil.” Then Satan answered the Lord, “Does Job fear God for nothing? Have You not made a hedge about him and his house and all that he has, on every side? You have blessed the work of his hands, and his possessions have increased in the land. But put forth Your hand now and touch all that he has. He will surely curse You to Your face.” Then the Lord said to Satan, “Behold, all that he has is in your power, only do not put forth your hand on him.” So Satan departed from the presence of the Lord. (Job 1:6-12 NASB)

     Notice Satan's objective here. He was showing his true hand. His stated desire was to get Job to curse God to His face. But Job remained faithful despite suffering the loss of his children, the loss of his wealth, enduring great pain and physical anguish, and even the repeated accusations of his friends and his wife that he had brought all of this upon himself by "sinning against God." But Job silenced the accuser by remaining faithful, and declaring faithfully in spite of it all that "the Lord gives, and the Lord takes away. Blessed be the name of the Lord."
     Like Job, the reward for those who likewise silence the accuser by remaining faithful to God will be great. Those who remain faithful to Him despite losing a mother, father or children will prove themselves worthy of inheriting the kingdom of God as their eternal family. Those who remain faithful to Him despite losing houses, property and material wealth will prove worthy of receiving mansions, properties and even kingships in eternity. Those who remain faithful despite suffering physical affliction and pain in this life will prove themselves worthy of enjoying great beauty and pleasure in eternity.
     But this accusation of the Devil that God delights in human sufferings will have to be withstood. Persecution will increase, and Satan's accusations that He delights in sufferings will grow louder as time goes on. The wise will know better, however, and as a result they will make their lives an eternal testimony to the fact that Satan's accusations against the God of Love were just lies, and that nothing could have been farther from the truth.


Notes: Interestingly enough, the Gnostics turn the story of Genesis 6:1-4 on its head, to say that Jehovah God was actually the first to commit rape against Eve, and that the sons of God merely emulated Him when they entered in among the daughters of men many years later:

https://www.gnosticdoctrine.com/search/label/devil
- Excerpt:
The creator god was the first to sin, and by his nature all that he created committed sin as he did and in like manner did his creations sin (sons and angels)... The authorities came up to their Adam. When they saw his female partner speaking with him, they became very excited and enamored of her. They said to one another, “Come, let us sow our seed in her,” and they pursued her... this is what the creator god and his sons did in the face of their Adam, and as they committed this against Eve, by force of rape, his watchers Semyâzâ, who was the leader of them, saw what the chief creator and his sons had done, waited till after children began to multiply on earth, then came down and mixed his seed with the seed of the sons and daughters of the creator god and that of man, this angered the creator gods that their bloodlines had been mixed with the blood of the watchers, he then blamed and charged this sin against man and the watchers. Moses was the first he used to destroy those that were left of the bloodlines of the watchers, then he the creator god used his Prophets of old to prophesy against the blood line of the watchers, and in his anger he sought to wipe out mankind so that the watchers could not again place their seed in the women of the earth. All these evils came upon this earth by the hands of the creator god and his sons, then his angels , the watchers, did the same and so mankind bore the blame for the evil he, the creator god, his sons, and the watchers had done. Now over the years they, the creator god and his sons played the rolls of many different gods and deities, creating many different religions, they continued to seek out the blood line of the watchers to destroy them, those that had escaped his flood...


A link to the Satanist article "God Must Be Evil"
http://www.dpjs.co.uk/god.html



« Last Edit: August 09, 2021, 05:47:21 PM by Hidden In Him »